By Foreign Secretary on the Visit of Prime Minister of Pakistan Mr. Shaukat Aziz

24/11/2004

Official Spokesperson: Good afternoon ladies and gentlemen. It gives me great pleasure to welcome Foreign Secretary for this afternoon's briefing. He is accompanied by India 's High Commissioner to Pakistan Mr. Shiv Shankar Menon and Joint Secretary (PAI) Mr. Arun Singh. Without further ado I will request FS to kindly address you.

Foreign Secretary: Thank you very much for being present here this afternoon. I would like to just give you a brief account of the meetings that were held today between Prime Minister Dr. Manmohan Singh and Prime Minister Shaukat Aziz of Pakistan . To begin with, there was a 45-minute restricted meeting with only a few aides present on each side. And thereafter we had a one-hour delegation-to-delegation level meeting. This was followed by a lunch hosted by the Prime Minister in honour of the visiting Prime Minister.

In the talks there was a very wide ranging exchange of views. This exchange took place in a very friendly and a very constructive atmosphere. As you know the Prime Minister of Pakistan is visiting India in his capacity as Chairman of SAARC. As it would be expected SAARC was an important item therefore on the agenda of the talks. Both sides agreed that SAARC had not really lived up to its potential and that there was a needed for us to work together in order to realize this potential. Prime Minister in his presentation concerning SAARC related issues mentioned several proposals that India has put forward for consideration at the forthcoming SAARC summit in Dhaka . These include the Poverty Alleviation Fund amounting to about USD 100 million which has been announced by India for use in various collaborative projects in countries other than India . We have also recommended an Infrastructure Fund, the total of which would be something like USD 10 billion. The Fund is to be utilized for several infrastructure projects involving collaborative ventures. For example, regional road network, energy network, communications network - these are the kind of things which could be taken up under the Infrastructure Fund.

Prime Minister mentioned our proposal for setting up a High Economic Council which would include Ministers of Finance, Commerce, may be representatives of Planning Commissions essentially to give shape to our vision of a South Asia Economic Union and the steps that we would need to take in order to fulfill that collective destiny that we all accepted.

Another SAARC related issues which was mentioned by us was the problem of HIV/AIDS and the need for common efforts on the part of all countries of the region to deal with this challenge. In this connection, as you know, India has certain experience in terms of HIV'AIDS drugs and treatment. So, this is an area where we can also make a contribution. In addition, Prime Minister also mentioned certain other areas like the possibility of pooling our resources together in terms of our energy requirements, the setting up of some kind of regional energy grid which could be considered by the countries of the region. The possibility of considering a proposal for food security among all countries of the region. So, as you can see, a number of rather important initiatives were mentioned by the Prime Minister in connection with how to energize the SAARC process.

Prime Minister Shaukat Aziz welcomed these proposals. In fact he stated that Pakistan supported these proposals. He had some ideas of his own to offer. He mentioned, for example, that we need to strengthen the mechanisms of SAARC, in particular the Secretariat itself. He also mentioned that we need to be conscious of the need to make our SAARC meetings much more productive, that we have a fairly long calendar of such meetings, we move from event to event, but we need to make our meetings shorter and perhaps more productive. These were ideas which Prime Minister Manmohan Singh welcomed and said we could certainly work together in realizing these objectives.

There was discussion about SAFTA, the importance of SAFTA and how to take this process forward. Prime Minister followed this up by mentioning the vision that we have of taking South Asia towards a Customs Union and then final a South Asia Economic Union. So, as you can see, on SAARC related issues a number of very substantive ideas were discussed. As I said, there was a general agreement that the SAARC process had really not lived up to the expectations that we have had and it is time now to energize the entire process and that India and Pakistan were committed to taking this process forward.

On bilateral issues, there was an exchange of views on all the different issues which are there on the bilateral agenda. There was satisfaction that the dialogue process was moving forward. There was a commitment from both sides to take this process forward. On our side Prime Minister said that we are committed to addressing all the different items of the bilateral agenda including the issue of Jammu and Kashmir and that we were prepared to do this in a very serious, in a very purposeful manner, in a manner that is oriented towards seeking constructively solutions to the problems that we are confronting. Towards the conclusion of our meeting there was a very gracious invitation extended to Prime Minister Dr. Manmohan Singh to pay a visit to Pakistan which was very warmly accepted. The dates for this visit would be worked out through diplomatic channels.

All in all this has been a very important ands significant visit, coming as it does on the eve of the Dhaka Summit where we need to take the SAARC process forward. It has also given us an opportunity to make a review of our bilateral relations even though the focus of the visit was SAARC. As you know we are embarked on the second round of the Composite Dialogue and there was a commitment on both sides to approach this second round with all seriousness. Also, a mention was made that we would be following the second round of the Composite Dialogue with a meeting between the Foreign Secretaries of the two countries which is likely to take place before the end of the year. There would be a chance for another meeting at the leadership level at Dhaka Summit and External Affairs Minister Shri Natwar Singh is also scheduled to visit Pakistan some time in February next year. So, the process is very much set for the next several months. We are convinced that this path on which we both have decided to walk together will yield results in the future.

Thank You.

Question: I have two questions. The first is that the first round of the Composite Dialogue Process has been completed. From all the issues that have come up - till the present visit of Mr. Shaukat Aziz, what are the issues about which we can be optimistic? Secondly, Mr Aziz has said that the Oil pipeline will be constructed irrespective of whether India wants it or not. Does it indicate an impasse since India has somewhat seen it in conjunction with the MFN status or the normalization of business relations?

Answer: As far as the Composite Dialogue is concerned, it is normal that on some issues we have moved forward and on some issues more time will be needed. This is very fair. On the issues on which we have not been able to make that much progress, we will take up those issues in the present round and we will try to make progress on those issues as well. But, broadly speaking we can say that on all these CBMs and bilateral issues we have achieved progress in the last few months. This should also be recognized. This is a long haul and I would like to emphasize that both sides are keen to move forward. As far as the issue of gas pipeline is concerned Prime Minister has shared with you his views on this.

Question: Can you elaborate as to what proposals, if any, were put forward on Kashmir by Pakistan and if Prime Minister Manmohan Singh raised the issue of terrorist infrastructure that exists in Pakistan with his Pakistani counterpart?

Answer: Prime Minister very clearly recalled the assurance contained in the January 6th Joint Statement between India and Pakistan , specifically referring to the assurance given by Pakistan that no territory under the control of Pakistan would be utilized for any cross border terrorism. This was conveyed by Prime Minister to his counterpart. It was also conveyed that India is committed to resolving all outstanding issues between India and Pakistan including the issue of Jammu and Kashmir and we are ready to move ahead in a very serious and purposeful manner.

Question: Did Pakistan give any specific formulation on Kashmir ?

Answer: No, there was no specific formulation given on Kashmir . As far as the reference to President Musharraf's proposals or so called proposals – I do not know whether they are proposals – what was mentioned, I think was clarified by Prime Minister Shaukat Aziz himself saying that these were really ideas put forward essentially for debate within Pakistan.

Question: Anything on the bus service from Srinagar to Muzaffarabad?

Answer: This matter was touched upon and it was agreed that this was a proposal which should be implemented as early as possible. You may be aware that there is a technical level meeting on this issue which is probably going to take place on December 7 – 8 this year where there will be an effort made by both sides to resolve any pending issues and operationalize the bus service as early as possible.

Question: Did the Indian side express its concerns over repeated statements that come from Pakistan each time such type of important meetings take place?

Answer: No, we do not believe that we need to react to each and every statement that comes from across the border.

Question: On the bus service the technical level talks are scheduled but the Prime Minister of Pakistan told us a short while ago that the issue of travel documents remains open. I would like to know what is India 's position on the passport and visa issues? My second question is that Hurriyat leaders met the Pakistani Prime Minister yesterday. They want to visit Pakistan to meet the Pakistani leadership there, what is the Government of India's position on that?

Answer: As far as the bus service is concerned I think that I stated very clearly that there is going to be a technical level meeting on December 7-8 and precisely the sort of matters that you are talking about will be discussed at the meeting and hopefully we will come to a satisfactory conclusion. As far as the role of the Hurriyat is concerned, we have an elected government in Jammu and Kashmir . The Government has expressed its willingness to talk to all shades of opinion in Jammu and Kashmir including those who are not from amongst the elected representatives in the state of Jammu and Kashmir . That remains the position of the Government of India. As far as travel to Pakistan is concerned, as and when these requests are made to the Government of India these requests will be considered.

Question: Are there any security concerns regarding Srinagar – Muzaffarabad bus service?

Answer: There would be a number of concerns like the question of procedures, question of security, question of documents. As I said these are precisely the sort of issues which we need to clarify and to work out and which we will do when we meet on December 7-8.

Question: You had given 70 to 71 proposals to Pakistan and some progress was made on these earlier. Has there been any progress on these issues during this visit?

Answer: Let me clarify again that this is a visit by Prime Minister Shaukat Aziz in his capacity as Chairman of SAARC. But, we have taken advantage of his visit also to revisit and review bilateral relations. This is not a negotiating session between the Pakistani delegation and the Indian delegation. For negotiations on various bilateral issues there is a mechanism within the Composite Dialogue and that particular mechanism is at work. We are not discussing specific issues with a view to finding common ground at this particular meeting. This is a meeting between two Prime Ministers. They are not negotiating on the nitty-gritty issues. There was an overall review. There was satisfaction that relations had gone forward. There was a common commitment to take these relations forward on the basis that we have already agreed. What is that basis? The basis is that we move ahead with our Composite Dialogue, try and find common ground, not put aside the issue of Jammu and Kashmir - as we said we are ready to talk about this issue as well - and bring a new climate to our bilateral relations.

Question: I have two questions. On the bus service, is India open to the Idea of travel on Passports without visa? Secondly, did the Prime Minister recall his statement in Srinagar on no redrawing of boundaries?

Answer: I think I have made myself very clear as far as the bus service is concerned. The kind of issues you are raising are precisely the issues that we hope to discuss and sort out in the technical level meeting that we have. So for me to say ‘is there going to be a passport without a visa or is there going to be a visa without a passport'… There are a number of ideas which are there on the table and I am sure perhaps there will be more ideas put on the table when we have the technical level meeting. So, why not wait? What is important is that this is an initiative that India has taken and we are very keen to see operationalized as early as possible. We will approach the technical level talks in a very constructive spirit, in a spirit of trying to get over whatever hurdles there may be so that something which, I think, is important to both the people of India as well as the people of Pakistan can be operationalized as early as possible.

As far as your second question is concerned, Prime Minister mentioned that what he had said in Srinagar was no different from what he had said to President Musharraf in New York .

Question: Were any trade related issues discussed?

Answer: Yes, Prime Minister said that he was very keen that there should be a greater economic and commercial linkage between the two countries. I am happy to tell you that it was agreed between the two Prime Ministers that we should have banking relations and we have agreed that we could have reciprocal setting up of banks in each others country and the Central Banks of the two countries will perhaps be taking this particular idea forward.

Question: You just mentioned that Prime Minister told Prime Minister Shaukat Aziz what he had said in Srinagar was no different from what he had told President Musharraf in New York . What did he say?

Answer: In discussing the issue of Jammu and Kashmir , Prime Minister mentioned that we have a very consistent and a very constructive stand on approaching the issue of Jammu and Kashmir . He recalled what he had mentioned to President Musharraf in New York .

Question: What exactly did he say?

Answer: Well, the Indian position is that we have a certain approach with regards to Jammu and Kashmir . What is that approach? That approach is that this is a complex issue. This is an issue, which has perhaps a considerable amount of emotion involved on either side. If we wish to try and seek an understanding on this question there is a need for building a degree of trust and confidence on both sides. How do we build that trust and confidence? How do we increase and expand the constituency of peace both on the Indian side and the Pakistani side? What is positive is that there is today, and this was something that was agreed by both Prime Minister Dr. Manmohan Singh and Prime Minister Shaukat Aziz, that there is a new mood amongst the people of both countries. People of both countries want peace. They want to take friendly relations between the two countries forward. So, why not try and expand that area of peace and friendship between the two countries so that it becomes easier to deal with this complex issue. In the way we look at it, the confidence building process is not a deflection from the Jammu and Kashmir issue. In fact, it is integral to seeking a solution to the complex problem of Jammu and Kashmir.

So, that is the approach that we have adopted and in terms of how this is to be brought about, Prime Minister had mentioned this publicly that we obviously cannot look at another division of the country on the basis of religion. We are not looking at territorial solutions. Ours is a people centered approach. We are looking at how we can somehow ameliorate the negative consequences of the lines which have been put on the map, try to bring people together. After all, what is the Srinagar – Muzaffarabad bus service about? This is also to bring people together. So, the affinities that are there on either side of the LoC or either side of the international boundary, those affinities should be allowed to expand. We should be able to build upon that. That is the approach that we have.

Question: Prime Minister Shaukat Aziz reiterated the old Pakistani line that there should be progress in other areas in tandem with progress on Kashmir . Does that not retard the confidence in the whole Composite Dialogue process?

Answer: We are moving in tandem. After all, what is the Composite Dialogue all about?

Question: Do you think that Pakistan is committed to take forward the process of Composite Dialogue? In the New York interaction Prime Minister Manmohan Singh had talked about out of the box solution. Is that a proposition that is still considered viable?

Answer: Prime Minister has stated before and I think he has stated again that we are willing to look at various kinds of options there might be. But, these options must be based on ground realities. So, how do we move forward? We move forward in a measured fashion as I just now spelt out for you that we regard the process of confidence building as not separate from dealing with the issue of Jammu and Kashmir . To our mind they are in fact linked together.

Question: Pakistan Prime Minister's statements suggest that Pakistan is fully now committed to the Composite Dialogue…

Answer: I do not wish to interpret what the Pakistani position is. As long as there is a commitment to carrying this process forward – and that seems to be the case at this point of time. I mentioned to you that till February we have a number of agreed high-level meetings that we are looking at. We have no reason to believe that this process will not continue and move forward.

Official Spokesperson: I think we will have to leave it there. Thank you very much ladies and gentlemen.

Thank You.